[00:00:00] S7 Ep3:" I was boxing it the wrong way, I'm going to be honest now, like I said, I lacked dedication in between fights and I'd put on over a stone, I was like a miniature Rick Hatton, I'd put on over a stone so I'd have to lose between the fights and eight for more body weight, it's a lot for a little person. And for that fight, I didn't have a fight for six months and I think I over trained.
[00:00:17] And I think my last spot, I swear, I swear, Teon and Corey Gibbs to a professional, local professional boxers. And my last spot, I couldn't be asked to chase it, I couldn't even have to be bothered to go after them. I didn't know then I'd peak too soon because I didn't know as much about peaking I suppose. In England I feel there's a lot of pressure, especially when I've lost on TV a couple of times, really like I wanted away from the spotlight I suppose. But when I lost the Laskins that was on TV, when I lost the prize-wise that was both on Sky Sports, so a lot of people.
[00:00:44] So it's amazing winning from the low T, but losing from the low T, but it chipped away a bit of pride a little bit. So I wanted to start again a little bit. In Australia, sad thing is, you know, I was there for three months and I found out my mum had cancer, so I had to come back home, you know. I was in the final, I thought it was a South African kid and I was battered him, I was so relaxed before the fight. I don't know, I just felt like, I felt no pressure, I really didn't and I went in and thought, Lord, it was just a kindness that I don't normally have I suppose. You know, and I slashed him, batted him around the ring.
[00:01:14] And I'll get, they've got to sell fights and you've got to hype things up, but I don't seem it's the same sport really. Do you know what I mean? There's, well, pressure boxing and this other Mickey Mouse boxing. Before we get into this, we're doing over a million engagements a month, but most of you aren't subscribed. If you enjoy the content, hit subscribe and follow us on socials. It'll make such a massive difference. Cheers. Morning lads, how are you both? With you. I'm alright mate, I'm alright. Thanks for coming.
[00:01:44] Thanks for having me mate. Thanks for gracing the hallowed turf. I mean, I was on the best player being his grandfather of oil. So people who don't know, give us a brief paragraph, I know it's going to be difficult, of Don Bordhurst. What's the biggest part of you? Well from a sporting perspective, in amateur boxing, I've been boxing when I was 10, I had my first fight on those 11.
[00:02:10] In the amateurs I had about 100 amateur fights with numerous national titles, boxing them 50 times, ABA champion, MSC champion, Commonwealth Games, Golden Middle East. I went to Olympic qualifiers with people like Amir Khan, loads of good fighters. And I could go in depth about my amateur thing. Then I turned professional with Frank Warren after the back of my Commonwealth Games. I was English champion, Midland champion, Commonwealth champion, brought for the British title twice. So I had 25 professional fights, I'm 21 out of 25.
[00:02:40] So I didn't have a bad career from a young lad from Erlington, where no one expects anything of you. To do so well in sport, and to give me the discipline to make me a better person, keep me on the strata narrow. I'm massively grateful for the sport of boxing, and now I've passed on my knowledge down at West Royce, a boxing club, trying to give back, and grassroots, because that's where I come from, what I believe in. So I want to help people, and I'm trying to be a good person.
[00:03:10] That's a good one. That's just about it sums it up. Cheers Dom. See you later. I'm like, that's it now, see you later lads. So you touched upon now, growing up in Erlington, where you grew up in Borsey Green, you're probably a bit younger than us. I'd say so. Just wait for yourself. Right, yeah. Me painting the roof. Yeah, I'm going to get some just cement immediately as soon as I'm going home. So growing up in Erlington, I imagine it was quite rough in Erlington back in the day. How you touched upon it then, boxing kept you off the streets.
[00:03:41] Where you live, it's not rough, but when we go to people like, I'm from Erlington, they're like, do you know what I mean? But you are what you're used to, and you can be a product of your environment. I also believe Erlington gave me that gritty determination, that roughness, to give me a good head start in boxing. Because when I did start, I weren't sure when it goes to sparring and stuff like that. I was just game and getting involved. Because that's, I suppose when you're from Erlington, you've got to look after yourself. And yeah, it's like in life, bullies won't bully people who look after themselves and stick for themselves.
[00:04:10] You know, obviously we don't want bullies anyway, but I believe in teaching kids about... I believe boxing should be in every school really. Keep people, teach kids about self-defence, martial arts, just protect yourself and just protect others. Do you know what I mean? Just, you know, yeah. It seems a definite link as well, between again, sport, physical activity, mental health. You know, the kids, if they're boxing, say martial arts and they're doing that, I think mentally they're in a better headspace, aren't they? Yeah, I think so.
[00:04:39] You know, when I was a kid, nowadays I probably would have been diagnosed, I probably on the spectrum at some degree. I don't know why I've made it because I'm not the poor ticket. But I think boxing used up a lot of my energy. You know, I'd finish school and I'd still go to the gym, I'd still be bounced off the walls after that. But it did burn up a lot of energy, sports always has done. And not just that, being at a boxing gym, I was around older people and that kind of made me grow up as well. Like when I was in junior school, I'd learned difficult courses. I was on footballs and beef chipping. I was on the lowest, lowest art books to do.
[00:05:09] I was with people like Dyslexic Relay. Then as I started boxing, it started to open up my mind being around older people. I think it's a good distraction for my home life. I know all the interactive, like my family and all that. So boxing up. Then after I finished senior school, like I've done 11, 12 GCs and a English. Most people do a one GC, they order two, one for English, language and one for literature.
[00:05:33] And I think that a lot of that because of boxing and it had helped me grow and mature and open my mind up and took away all the distractions. Yeah. So when, because I'd seen on one of your other interviews, so you got into boxing, he was your coach. He just said, do you want to come down and try boxing? What do you want to do with him? I went to Birch's Green Junior School and Paul Bond, the caretaker of that school, he must have seen you in the playground. Scrapping. I'd unsaved your reputation, he had you tell.
[00:06:04] So he just said, come along, Don. I'll look at fish to water. Luck is that I had an older brother Graham and big sister. So I used to scrap with your brothers and sisters. And I think that makes you not show away from being competitive or conversational, really. It comes to become second nature when you're getting beat up with your big brother and sister in it. Yeah. Yeah. So you just step in, it's like you say, it's just like fish to water, then stick some gloves on you and you feel like the most natural thing in the world then to fight. Yeah.
[00:06:32] I remember when I was age 10 at our gym, our international boxing club, that I took us to a boxing show when I was about 10, 11. We were just going there to watch because I'd never been to a show before. But I even took a gum show with me just in case I could get a fight. I hadn't even registered. But that was my mentality of game as a badger from the get-go. And yeah. What was that? Do you remember the actual first fight you had then? Yeah. My first fight was in another football stadium. The show was Plec Amish Boxing Club. It's a Walson football ground.
[00:07:01] And it was like looking out on a picture like this now. And yeah, there's a matter for a lad called Alan Wilt from Plec's The Home Show. So when he was fighting, everyone was cheering for him because he's the home boxer. And I like me and my corner men really. And I stood him on his head there and I beat him easy really. Do you know what I mean? But that was the first thing. But like I said, I wasn't... I can't say... I was nervous about it for him because you are because you have nervous energy. But I'm not scared to fight. Do you know what I mean? It's something I wanted to do. Like if they'd set down your boxing the week before.
[00:07:30] I would have gone in the gym and boxing a week. Do you know what I mean? Because that was my mentality. And luckily enough, I stuck with it along the way. It's the ups, the downs, the adverse. And I kept on going, kept on going. And yeah, it helped me get somewhere else first. When did you realise I'm decent at this and people around me believe in me and I could make it as a career? When I was 10, before I had a fight, I often go, is that good for I'm sparring? Do you know what? When you're battering people all the time, you're sparring.
[00:07:58] And when you're 10 years old and you're knocking people on the floor and they're like big in you, heavy in you. You kind of know, my coach would give me the confidence. They made me believe in myself. Not that I didn't, but they did even more. And before I had my first one, I was going to, what's the longest knockout streak in amateur boxing? What's the longest undefeated record? Because that was how confident I was before I'd even had a fight. Because if you don't believe in yourself, who else is going to? And I believe in having confidence. But you can't just believe in yourself and not do the hard work. Do you know what I mean? I think hard work is the biggest ingredient for success. You need a bit of luck.
[00:08:28] But without the belief and the hard work that I come together, anyone can be successful at anything if you put your mind to it and try hard enough. Yeah. Yeah, because I'd seen, again, I'm one of your previous insiders, you were saying football, you played a lot of football as well. Sport just come naturally to you in general. Yeah, I've probably been small, very competitive, little man syndrome probably. Low centre of gravity. Yeah. The hell there and I. So yeah, I was playing at Holy Land. I played from when I was 12. I was captain for Holy Land. Our captain left the second season. I was captain for them.
[00:08:57] So they held me in quite high self-esteem. Went from Division 4 to 2 to 1. And then we got kicked out of the league. We did. So we were banned from the Septuil actually. What was that for? Some players got into a fight. I don't know. I was having an orange at half time. I was hiding in the chamber. You can't prove otherwise. I put the orange in my mouth. It was a gum shield. So yeah. And then I went to play for some time boys. And I was top goal scorer for them. At school, I played with Stefan Moore at school. He's in my year. He's in my class actually. And then we lost one game in three years. We won everything.
[00:09:26] Then everyone stopped playing really. Which was too good really. And I suppose Steph was at Villa. My arm drive was at West Brom. My arm drive was at Shrewsbury. Then everyone stopped playing really. Because there was more important things than I suppose that the professional clubs was with. But then I was kind of trying to box him more myself really. How easy did you find it to kind of keep your head down with boxing and stay the course at that time? Because obviously like you say, people start venturing out. And now the world gets bigger and brighter.
[00:09:55] Women, clubs, bars. It's my cause. I didn't achieve much until I was a senior. Otherwise there and there about. I was always one of the best in the country. But I weren't the number one. And I think I was a bit of a lazy trainer as a kid. I'd be talking to people. I'd be distracting people. Because that's what I was. And when it comes to sparring. I'd try hard on the pads. I'd try. But not circus. I'd do nothing. I was a bit lazy kid. But I believed in my natural ability. So eventually when I got certain age of work done. I'm 15, 16 now. You're going to have to. It's make or break.
[00:10:25] You're going to have to put your head down. Because I didn't start running until I was 15, 16. So all these years. But he'd run into the chippy or something. Do you know what I mean? Just watching Rocky go. That's bollocks. So you ain't got to do it. I was watching. But I was hoping he'd do the road work for me. But then I thought. I've been doing it so long. I'm there and thereabouts. If I'm putting a bit more hard work now. I'm going to get there. And I was right really. So I stayed because I knew how good I was. I just needed to have more dedication. I'd say. So what was the path then to.
[00:10:56] Amateur competitive competitions. How did you kind of progress. From just boxing locally to. Well you're going to national champions every year. So from the age of 12. I was in the school boys. So I got to two school boys. Semi-finales and two quarter finals. So I was always winning the best in the country. I lost to the winner three times. So from the age of 12. All the way through. I was there and thereabouts. So in about 16. I went to the. It's called the East Durham Box. International Boxing Academy in Durham. I lived in Durham for two years. And we had three England coaches.
[00:11:26] And all the other lads. A lot of them boxed for England. So. And I learned so much off them. And I think that was a big thing that. Stopped me from being an early man. To actually getting me over the line. And that's when I won my first national title up there. I was boxing for Birmingham Irish. Like in Birmingham. And my coach Tony Ryan. A great man. Like I said. All my coaches throughout my career. From Ernst and Joe. Paul. And then when I was at Aston John. I've always had good coaches. Do you know what I mean? Luckily enough. Where I'd travel to gyms. To make sure I've got the best coaching. Or the best sparring.
[00:11:56] You know. When I was about 15. Come from Ernst and get two buses to Champions League. Would I get two buses to Borgia Green. To Burn Morris or. Yeah. So I'd always travel to gym. To give myself the best possible chance of success. Do you know what I mean? And even when I went to Ernst and like 10. I was walking from. Wilder and Ernst in Birchers Green. All up Ernst all road. To Kingsborough Community Centre. And it's not a nice ride. It's going up there all through the dark. And all that. It's quite daunting. But I believe you. My dad said to me when I was younger. He wants something in life done. You've got to go and do it yourself. Do you know what I mean? You can either work for it.
[00:12:26] Or you can go and rob it. Do you know what I mean? Great advice. Mm-hmm. Do you find that in Birmingham. There's this funny thing about Birmingham. With coaches. And we've heard through people. And guests. And stuff like that. Do you think. There's a uniqueness to Birmingham. Fighting. Okay. Who was older than me. And Matthew McIntyre. They were the two lads I looked to really. But being the second. The second city. The second biggest city in Britain. That's not. Is it really?
[00:12:56] Then coming through the ranks. Then you had me. Frankie. The Yafois. But still overall. We've not had an abundance of talented boxers from Birmingham. I know there's a lot of the McCrackens and that before that. But there's a bit more time. But when I look at it. I'm like. The first world champion. We've got Wayne Alcock. WVU. Then the Cal Yafo. WI. But we've not had an abundance of block success. Yes. Right. Galal Yafo. Not long. Olympic gold medalists. And I think that's a crazy brilliant achievement. So. For how big this city is. And how many people have got. I think we've underachieved.
[00:13:27] Why? Who knows. Who knows. Different reasons. That's the right point that is. Because you say. Oh yeah. Birmingham. You know. Little old Birmingham. It's not little old Birmingham is it? Second biggest city in Britain. Do you know what I mean? We should have achieved more really. Maybe there's been a lot of inspiration with coaches and all that. That stop people from progressing. Or maybe because. We're not from London or Manchester. We've got less opportunities. But at the same time. We've got to create opportunities. You're the best. And you kick up front door down.
[00:13:55] They can't stop you. Within reason. If you keep winning. Keep winning. They can't ignore you. Yeah. Yeah. That's true. It's 2006. Tell us. Let's walk us through. The games. Do you know. It's just a privilege. Just get picked. To go Commonwealth Games. You know. It's a massive. Major sporting competition. Like watching the beat. It's watching all over the world. There's like 15 countries in it. And it's like a third of the world. And just going there. Being picked. Just. I was proud to be picked. Just to get a medal. I would have been happy with it.
[00:14:24] If I'd come my way with a bronze. I would have been a card done. But like. You know. But getting a gold. It's still like mad. And now. Like when people. I speak to people. It don't seem real. Do you know what I mean? Still. And maybe I think. You do realise what an achievement is. Like when we had the. Cargagging Bangor. In 2022. I went to my daughter Nancy's school. And I took my medal up there. And it made me realise. All my hard work. To inspire my children. Said their dad's done something. They made it all worth it. Maybe I should have started running earlier.
[00:14:53] But them runs later on. That were worth it. Oh that's yeah. That's amazing. To be able to say. Yeah. You know what we do now. I've got a gold for this. Yeah. So it's surreal. But going there with the group of lads. That did me. Frankie. Stephen Smith. James Gall. Tony Jeffries. David Price. Stephen Smith. We had a brilliant squad. And great camaraderie. We'd all been through the England. From the juniors to seniors together. So a lot of us had a team out for a long time. We had a good bond. And that's what made our team so good. I think our relationships and friendships. And you know.
[00:15:22] We was in common with each other. Because we all want to do better each other. We all want it to do well. But we all want to. Like how good everyone was. The bar kit is getting higher and higher and higher. And we're just trying to like outgrew each other. So we all want to do well. It's a lot of healthy competition maybe. You know. Everyone wants to be the best. Or they don't lose in like. It won't but us. Because we're all winners in it. Yeah. Yeah. Because that. So that's your fight. You were the first. You won gold first. And was that the first of five golds at that? Well it was.
[00:15:52] Jamie Cox got a boner for. And we knew he got gold. But I was the first to win gold that day. So I was the last Englishman. To box. Because I got a boner first round. So the last one to box. But the first one to box in the final. So all my fights were in the shortest amount of time. But yeah. But in the final. I fought a South African kid. And I was battered him. I was so relaxed before the fight. I don't know. I just felt like. I felt no pressure. I really didn't. And I went in a fight. Like. It was just a kindness that I don't normally have. I suppose. You know.
[00:16:23] And I slashed him. Backed him around the ring. You know. I speak to him now on social media. And not long ago. He won like a fringe world title. He come to England. On a Frank Wine show. Can you be shot. You're called Bethel Green. And he turned over the local ads. And he won like a fringe world title. So. Up until a couple of years. He's still doing well. It was his birthday. But then I wished him happy birthday. Because we box. When you've been in a ring with someone. You kind of have a. A respect for him. And like a friendship for life. You know. You've tried. But you. You're willing to take a life. And give a life. And beat each other up. And all that. So.
[00:16:52] Not saying don't respect the people. It's a different respect gained. From giving each other up. And putting. And the risk you've taken against each other. Yeah. It's funny you should say that. About the camaraderie though. Because I'd come down here. With. When Tony Bellew came down. And you were sitting there. With Frankie and stuff. And you could just tell even. Though. And it's a lad thing as well. You haven't seen. But. And the instant banter is still there. Isn't it? Because of the amount of time. We have spent together in the past. You know what I mean. That England team. We couldn't block it. You're a sugar family really. So we.
[00:17:22] Like. Say now. We've got friends. I know it's the only time. But still my friends. And like. You know. If like. They're proper friends. When you feel like. You've seen him yesterday. But he went. That's not what a proper friendship is. And there's no awkwardness. Or nothing. And like. Just every Tony. Hey. We all got along really well. On squads and all that. And you know. So we've seen my friends do success. Be successful. And you're happy for him. Like. I spoke to Tony briefly. The other day. He went to World War II. Like 10 years ago. And um. Yeah. He's got the sun on it. Yeah. So we don't speak to him. Because he's pro there. I'm doing it. But um. I'm still supporting him.
[00:17:52] Even though it's him. You know. The best friends. Are the ones that support you. In different rooms. I mean. With my mates. I slag them off to the face. Because we go face. But in a different room. I'll be frank. I'll defend them to the hilt. Anyone. I'll never let anyone say nothing bad about my friend. Because I think. Loyalty. It goes a long way. And it's something that's ingrained in me. Right. So. Off the back of that then. What's the. What's the decision making. With. Going pro. As opposed to sticking around in amateur. I'd already.
[00:18:21] I kind of have. If I knew I'd won gold. I thought I was going to turn pro anyway. I'd struggle with the iron's hot. Um. The Olympics weren't for another two years. And I'd already more or less done the Olympics. So I put. Because I nearly went. I went to the 2004. I think. Happens Olympic qualifiers. Only a mere qualified for my team. Even though we still have a good team. But. There's a lot of politics in international boxing. And I was two fights away from being an Olympian. And then I beat people who've been in Olympics. Won Olympic medals. But sometimes you need to look at a draw. A bit of a rub of the green. And it worked my time. But. Yeah.
[00:18:49] I've done that many England squads for that many years. I think I needed a new challenge. You know. Maybe if I waited now. And wait for Beijing. I'll beat a lad who got a bronze in Beijing. And. But no. It really is. Like you can't. You can't have regrets really. Because. Yeah. You can't change your past. What's wrong with it. Now as I've got older now. And more educated. I try and live in the present as much as I can. I do. I am appreciative of my past. The highs loads are. Good and bad. Aversing. Good things then. And I've tried to plan for a happy future. But sometimes you've got to just.
[00:19:19] Concentrate on what you're doing now. And stay centred. And live in the present. If I forget. What I'm doing sometimes. I just concentrate on what I'm doing. So I'm at work. I'm doing this. I'll talk. I'll go through mentally. What I'm actually doing to keep myself present. The thing is. The world we live in now. It's just information. Information. There's a lot. You open your phone. It's just information. It's a lot going on. And that all the time. So yeah. Being able to just be in the present. And just worry about what you're doing right now. It's no small thing. Is it? What's the difference between professional and amateur? Well back in my day.
[00:19:49] It's 4-2 amateur boxing. It's computer scoring. It's more like. I'd say it's more technical really. Like now it's 10-9 rounds. Not professional boxing. It's 3-3. So it's close to professional boxing now. And they took their headguards off. Which I disagree with. There have been so many knockouts and cuts since. And that's hindered people to turn professional. Hindered their career. As much as amateur boxing. Olympic boxing. It's a great standard. Probably the better amateurs. Probably got a lot better than the better pros. But I don't think their career should be cut short. So soon.
[00:20:19] Give them a chance. Do you know what I mean? And I think it does hinder a lot. Without a headguard. And with the scoring change now. It's more an aggression rather than. Like Salop Frankie. He's a counter puncher. South ball long. That is not as suited now to the score. I'm not saying. Frankie still likes South because he's brilliant. But the scoring point scoring is different. So he'd have to adapt himself more. And I think he'd have the ability to do that. But it's not the same. The two different. It's not like tennis and badminton. But there's a difference. I mean.
[00:20:49] You're both hitting like a shortcut or a ball over a net. Rugby league. Rugby union. A little bit. Maybe. But there's a slight. There's similarities. But there's differences. Yeah. Same thing. If you fight to a point system. And that's the way you've trained. Then it's a completely different thing then. To fight in a different way. Isn't it? Yeah. So you were. You were a technician. Weren't you? You were a skilled boxer. I'd say. I was a controlled aggressor. Or a counter attacker. Like I was quite small and strong. Like with amateur boxing. Especially in my day. Having long limbs.
[00:21:19] And helped me being a short arse. It didn't help. But I suppose. Just my ability to move my head. And close the range. And that's like the good coach I've had over the years. That improved me. But like. I would have been more suited to the amateurs now. My free free. There's more aggression. I just learned to adapt to the computer scoring. Because I wanted to succeed at that. That was what it was. So that's what you ought to be good at. And if it would have been scoring now. I think I would have been good at that. I think I would have been more suited now. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:21:47] Like I thought I was definitely more suited to the pros than the amateurs. Just stylistically. Yeah. So how did it come about then signing with Frank Warren? After the Commonwealth Games. He was doing a column in the News of the World. And he mentioned everyone who won gold medals. Like us. And like how he'd like to sign us. And I thought like Frank is still one of the best promoters in the world now. Look. And he was then like. Like at the time we had a lot of Colzaga. I met your boxer mate. Timo Kahn. And all the stars. And Kevin Mitchell.
[00:22:15] So it was a privilege for him to even mention my name. But I think winning what I would. I deserved to be mentioned in that name. Do you know what I mean? Because of what I'd achieved. So yeah. And I thought. You know. I'll see what I'll say. I thought I got on these score shows. Big shows. And he's someone I'll relish and look forward to. You know. I thought I was more suited to the pros. I had longer time to work out my opponents. I used to knock a lot of people out in the amateurs with big gloves and headguards. I thought. I'm made for the pros. Smaller. Lower guards. Smaller gloves.
[00:22:44] Longer duration. But I think in the pros. My thoughts are too far. They weren't close enough to too far between. And I think that hindered me. Because in between fights. I put in between. But I lacked dedication. I'd gone out drinking. Clubbing and stuff like that. If I'd fought more regularly. I'd be in the gym more. Because I'd been boxing so many years all my life. I found myself twiddling my thumbs in between fights. And what am I meant to do? And that was my career. My vocation. So. I had no responsibilities really. So. That hindered me. Maybe if I looked. But no.
[00:23:15] I should have gone out more in moderation. But I suppose. Being a boxer. It's all or nothing. I was in and out. You know. Now I've grown up and matured. You've got to be. Just. I would have won so much more. But you weren't meant to be in. It is really isn't it? To be fair. Birmingham was buzzing then though as well. Weren't it around that time? What was your. What was your favourite pubs or bars? You know.
[00:23:43] I used to go to something like Roses a lot. I brought Barracuda a lot. Randy Arcadian. Moon Lounge. Arca Bar. And being from the boxing background. I used to have a lot of mates from Birmingham. I used to have all doorman. I was going up to them when I was like 17 and stuff. I was that big. I'm only that big now. So I was going. A lot of people going. What are you doing? Done what you're doing in here. But because I knew all the doorman. I could go and play some of my young guys. I get looked after. Walk to the. Walk to the front. Done coming in. So I got encouraged through that as well. Yeah. And it's nice that comes the.
[00:24:13] At the time. It is nice to be popular. But I think as you get older. I think. I know I'm on here today. But I do shy away from publicity a lot of the time. All my social media is on private. Do you know what I mean? But no. I think. Because I've got a platform. Why not use it? To encourage people to start boxing. Keep out of trouble. Go to school. Be happy. Mental health. Live. Do you know what I mean? I feel I should use what I've got to help people. Well you've got. You've got the gravity of lived experience as well. Haven't you?
[00:24:42] If you can take advice. Low centre of gravity. No I'm at me as well. I'm only short as well. I was a winger. That was always my old thing. Low centre of gravity. You've got to use your advantages haven't you? Neil to the grass off the ground. But yeah. You've got lived experience. You're a gold medalist. Your advice carries some weight doesn't it? Well obviously I coach now. West Rock's boxing club in Soluil. And you know. I speak to lads. Not just about training. But about education. Doing well at school. Because boxing. It's the 1% that make money out of it really.
[00:25:12] So like I said. I try and say to lads. If you can't read very well. How are you going to read your contract? If you're not very good at maths. How are you going to sign all these checks with millions of pounds? So I try to make boxing and education relevant. Do you know what I mean? So I can't merge them two together. Because. I don't know. I think a lot of kids. Especially sportive kids. They're not very academic. You've got loads of energy. You know. Their intelligence is maybe on the pitch. Or in a ring. Not academic. I mean. Sitting down at a desk isn't for them.
[00:25:42] No it's not. Because you've got more energy. Or different abilities. There's strengths and weaknesses in all walks of life. Yeah. Yeah. So. Commonwealth Gold. Turned professional. Fought a lot of Garnayans. Yeah. I've seen a lot of Garnayans on the. The top right now. Is that just a profile? Is there just a really solid profile of Garnayans? That size and weight. In boxing. I think maybe because. There's a lot.
[00:26:12] In Garnayans. There's probably a lot of boxers. Because it's a poverty sport. They've had a rich history of professional boxers as well. So it's probably a popular sport. And obviously. The matchmaking and. Boxing. Your promoter. Or manager. Tries to get you. Get the cards stacked in your favour. To win. Realistically. Because it. First and foremost. It's a business than a sport. So they're getting people thinking. They can challenge me. But all you can beat.
[00:26:41] And sometimes it is sink or swim. And just because it's. The Commonwealth title. You've got to have someone from a Commonwealth country. And maybe it might have been cheaper. To get them from Ghana. Than in England. I don't know. Things and that. It's obviously. Because I'm a manager. But maybe they had a bunch of lads. We were. Able to fight for a title at that time. And the politics that were involved. Yeah. So. Once you won the title. Because I saw the interview. After you'd won it. And you weren't too pleased. Were you? No. A black on a bruise.
[00:27:11] And it was like. Yeah. He's solid. He said he's game. He keeps coming at you. But you know. You've won. I think from the amateurs. In a computer school. You think of defence more than attack. So. In a pros. So. I've planted my feet more. No head guards. I still think I should have got hit. As much as I did. But. Don't forget. I'm doing 12 rounds. I'm doing three times. Your manager. Doing four rounds. You know what I mean. So. Obviously I'm going to get hit a few more times. But. I've won easy. I've decided on myself. I'm my own biggest critic. Because even though. You have to be done. Yeah.
[00:27:42] It's alright. Me like me bigger myself. But at the same time. I've got to set myself to task. When I do things wrong. And if I feel like. I've got hit too many times. It's down to me. Really. To think done. How I've got to improve. I've got to move my head. Move my feet. Because the book stops with me. I'm the one getting the ring. I'm the one taking the punches. So I've got to want to. Take the responsibility. To make myself improve. Yeah. Super hard on yourself though. Isn't it? Do you know what. It's tough at the top. And if you're not your own biggest. I can bet. If you're going to be your own biggest fan. You've got to be your own biggest critic. Does that kind of.
[00:28:12] Does that kind of throw your. Throw your equilibrium off as well. Going from head guards. Where you know. You'll take a knock. But you kind of. Yeah. You feel it. Taking them straight with the smaller gloves. I think you are more cautious. Because in the amateurs. I never had a cut. Then when I got my first cut. I got my fifth or sixth profile. I only got a nick. But I don't. I don't know what it's like. So it made me a bit cautious. Because you can lose a fight. Just by an accidental headbutt. And I didn't want to lose. Whatsoever. Let alone that way. And at the same time. I weren't rough with my head anyway. I didn't want to headbutt other people really.
[00:28:41] I want to win as fairly as I can. Yeah. Yeah. We had Conor on. And he said. You've got to get used to getting punched in the face. Don't you? Particularly without headguards. And stuff like that. You've just got to. Because your body automatically would be like. I've just been in place. The best thing is get hit early. To kind of wake you up. Ring your bowels. Well when I first started boxing when I was 10. I probably never wore headguards to my first fight. So for over a year. I was really anti-headguards. I hated headguards as a kid. Because I was so used to not wearing them.
[00:29:10] And I believed I was a tough little lad. So headguards were like. But as you get older. You've got to protect yourself at all times lads. Yeah. Yeah. Bloody right. So. So going on to the Haskin fight then. Again. Watching that back. He was probably. I know he'd gone up to Bantam. Lost a couple. But he looked. Big. For that weight. Again in regards to. Height reach.
[00:29:40] What was. Talk us through that folks. I know. Obviously being the first defeat. Well I was boxing at the wrong weight. I'm going to be honest now. Like I said. I lacked dedication in between fights. And I put on over a stone. I was like a miniature Rick Hatton. I put on over a stone. So. I'd have to lose between the fights. And eight for more body weight. It's a lot for a little person. And for that fight. I didn't have a fight for six months. And I think I over trained. And I think. My last spot. I spent. Teon and Corey Gibbs. That are professional. Local professional boxers. And my last spot. I couldn't be asked to chase.
[00:30:09] I couldn't even have to. Be bothered to go after him. I didn't know then. I'd peak too soon. Because I didn't know. As much about peaking. I suppose. But then when I got in the ring. I felt flattered. I couldn't be bothered. And because of his style. And having negated mine. If I got into a good luck brawl. It would have brought me out a bit. Because he's long strong. He picked me up. Put a lot in the first round. And walked around me. Like I was a doll really. Then about ten years later. I made eight stone. For the first time. So I was making the wrong weight. For a long time. I took the responsibility myself.
[00:30:40] In between fights. I weren't living a life. But at the same time. Me being that big. And fighting people this big. I think someone should have. Took my outside. Said done. Are you at the right weight? Or the people who coached me. Done. Do you know what? We're going to see you. A proper nutritionist. Or you're going to get all your. Your bone density weight. And put you in a pool. And get your. Everything done properly. More professionally. And I think. Maybe I lack someone. Taking my side and saying. At the same time. Maybe I should have done it myself. But you can't do what you don't know. I suppose. Yeah. So in hindsight.
[00:31:09] Which is one of the things. I should have been eight stone. If I was eight stone. I would have been a world champion. A million percent. Then I actually made eight stone years. Down the line. I drew for the English title. Up in Leicester. Against the champion. Louis Norman. I got an away draw. I snapped my tendon mark. And my right shoulder. So for five rounds. I was boxing with one arm. I got an away draw. Everyone knows what an away draw is. It's a win. Then I did a boxing. Another two years. So I've had loads of time. And outside the ring. And inactivity. Like. If I'm at the ring for two. Two years. And I can't train. I'm going to put on my.
[00:31:39] And also. Yeah. Losing all that weight again. It's demoralising. It made me hate boxing sometimes. But like I said. I should have probably. Been more dedicated. But. Yeah. Because. How do you. Because. Frankie had mentioned. That he sat on a bike. In a sauna. For two hours. To drop weight. Like. How on earth. Are you getting down to weight like that. When you're not fighting. When you're in a sauna. What makes it harder. If you're not living life in between fights. There's a big difference between. Losing a half stone and a stone. Do you know what I mean. So like I said. Like now. I mean.
[00:32:10] I live a better lifestyle now. Because. I feel like I don't have to do what I want to do. Yeah. Boxing. I felt like it was my job. In the amateurs. I loved it. Training and the pros. I didn't as much of. If I like a job. And you feel like a bit more pressure. Because when you're fighting. You're on TV. The highs are highs. The lows are lows. And you're selling tickets. You're running around. Though I was a good ticket seller. When people like. You're training. You're dieting. You don't want to think to make weight. Then people going. Oh Don. I can't have these tickets. You know. You're running around all around. Boom. Going like. I was a good ticket seller.
[00:32:40] And I'm running around. And I'm killing myself. And it has a knockdown effect. Like your morale. Ragehips. Friendships. It does. It's a bit demoralising. But like I said. It's my own fault. For not living the life. You know. It literally is. So you've spoken openly. About mental health struggles. And stuff. Tell us about those. Because it's massive. And it's. Yeah. My dad's a man's man. He didn't show much emotion. Growing up. I know he loves us very much. Because he's done anything. To give us a good life. But. He wouldn't sit me down and go.
[00:33:09] We never had that chat ever. About the birds and the bees. Or any type of like. I mean. Emotional chat. So mental health. To me. It was a taboo subject. We're men's men. And I'm. I say myself. A mentally tough man. But. After that Haskins fight. I didn't know what depression was. But. Like. I'd stay in my bedroom. Like. Sitting on a computer. Or I'd be out. Getting pissed. It was one or the other. But I didn't really realise. What depression was. But that losing to me. Took a lot.
[00:33:39] Took a bit of myself. Why really? And you know. It's only when you get. In your future. You can look back. And think. In a bad mental place. Matt. If someone tried to give me advice. Matt. What would this? I'm able. Maybe I thought I knew it all. Because you do. When you're young. You think you know it all. But. You kind of don't. I think. The older you get. You realise. You realise. The less you know really. And I'm still. I'm still learning now. There's loads. I don't know. Do you know what I mean? But no one at that time then. So no one's. Tried to guide you. No.
[00:34:08] I don't think. I don't think. I had the support. I should have got. When I look back now. But. At the same time. A professional athlete. You're a man. Would have listened. But. I don't think I had the support. Or maybe. No one. Maybe because I was in my room. Or out getting pissed. Maybe no one knew. What I needed to support. My boss put a brave face. Someone people say I'm pissed. And cheer you all. That what. Deep down. Losing on TV. Against someone. I think I should have beat. Or I had better ability than.
[00:34:37] But my boss should have beat him. He's better than me at that weight. If it was a weight below. I think I would have won. But. It is what it is. But. You know. To be the best. You can't believe me. You're the best. And I'm a proud man. And Lee went on to have a brilliant career. World champion. And he beat me in prize fighter. Again. I was trying. I was anti-final. Jimmy Frankie. I was training. But I didn't have a fight. Scheduled. So I'd still be going out again and pissed and all that. Then I found out in prize fighter two weeks before. So I come down from 9 stone 3. And we had to be 8 stone 5. That's a lot of weight in two weeks for a small man. So.
[00:35:07] Same again. The day before. The day before. The day before. The day before. The day before. I was in a sauna. It's like a little tent. It comes up to your neck. And I was. So. Like. Just drained. My first fight against. Mark Robinson. He's. Tower Hill box. Probably Liverpool. Good. Ex-national champion. He's a good lad. But. It's a close part. I thought I had nothing in me. But. His last chance to loon. Well he weren't. But he's kind of far. Like last chance to loon. Then I lost him in the final. Lee knocked me down for the first time in my whole life. Don't forget. Before 12 rounds. He didn't hurt me.
[00:35:37] And I'd had 100 damage fights. 20 pro fights. I'd never been down in sparring fights. Never. Never touched a canvas. Never even be wobbled. Then for him to knock me down. He's a big puncher anyway. But I know it's more to do with the weight. Than him. But how I got through the fight. I'll never know. Like. I've looked away from the referee. See my eyes. And I went up to sleep. Because of a bit of kidology. My instincts made me do that. Because I wasn't there. My mind wasn't clear. But I got through. I lost on points. And I looked to the better man. The bigger man. The better man.
[00:36:07] And. Yeah. It's just mad. But all part of the experience. I had my tail. My tail to tail. Not like. I can pass on my information. My knowledge. My learning curve. To other people now. So don't make the same mistakes as me. Yeah. Well. There. Straight away. Let's say the guidance on nutrition and lifestyle. The guidance of someone to say. Look. This isn't really the weight class for you. We can do this at the low weight class. High weight class. Someone. With. Professional. Experience. And grounding.
[00:36:36] To be able to guide you. Like you say. You might not have took the advice. But it would have been nice to have it. Everyone bigger than me. And I was. Doing well. So no one thought. Okay. I'd have done. This is a bit beyond you. But then. When you're fighting at that level. Then extra three pounds. Is a massive difference. That's all. There's weight categories. And at the low weight categories. It's like. Like. From eight stone. To eight stone. Four. It's only three pounds. You get up the weight. It's more. But. They are there. Really. Probably. I'm probably going to ring about. Eight. Probably eight. Seven.
[00:37:05] It's probably over nine stone. But it is a bigger man. You know. Fair play. We're still speaking on social media. And I wish his son. Happy birthday. His son's doing well. In professional boxing. And like I said. You have a bond with someone. You've tried to punch his head. And I wish him all the best. Well. It's like. Losses are lessons. Aren't they? That's the. Sounds a bit cliche. But it is. Isn't it? You've got to take something from. The negative experience. You can take those experiences. And help mould. And advise someone else. Before I fought Lee. I didn't fight for six months. Then after. After. I lost to him. I didn't fight for nine months.
[00:37:35] I lost one fight then. So. And none of that is any fault of my own. No injuries. Nothing. And that didn't help whatsoever either. What was it? Just getting shows cancelled left, right and centre? Yes. I was. Unfortunate shows getting cancelled. Opponents pulling out. I think when you do lose. You're not flagged for a little bit. Do you know what I mean? Is that it? Quickly. It swings. Off the back of one fight like that. Because you were 11-0 to them. Aren't you? Yeah. 11-12-0. Because I just didn't feel it off.
[00:38:04] I'd left it in the ring. In the gym. And I felt really flat. So I don't think I'd done as much as I could have on a different day. And maybe that didn't help my performance enough. You know what? I don't mind. Do you know what? I do mind losing. But I prefer to lose and box well. I think he's a better person than me. I'm going to go back to drawing board and learn now and progress. Yeah. Where I didn't feel like I lost someone better than me. I felt like I lost to myself before the fight even happened. In the gym really. On the scales. Yeah. For that fight I guess asking. If not I made eight stone years. Ten years later. I had to take my pants off to make eight three.
[00:38:34] And I trained long and half that boy. Probably over trained. And at the end I started getting bored. And so you still. You still. You still haven't knotted. A bit of food you shouldn't have. Because you've been doing it for so long. And it catches up with you I suppose. Yeah. Because even like from playing football. From kids. Little league and all that. It's a natural thing where you get to 14, 15. You just get bored don't you? Like I say. Your friends are going to have. When you've done it from ten. And you've enjoyed the amateurs. And then pros feels like a job. You lose a bit of passion. I can't sit down and do nothing.
[00:39:04] Probably I can now as I got older. But as a kid. I just couldn't. I feel like I'm missing out on life. Every day that goes. Boy you can't get back. So if I had the opportunity to have fun. I'm going to do it. I'm going to go out and have fun. I don't care. Because life's short. And tomorrow's problems. So anything can happen. Can't it really? Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Is there a point where you just thought. Sod it. Yeah. Yeah. There was different points. There was. I remember. I think I offered a fight. And I was over 9 stone. I rang my dad. Just a bit annoyed. Said dad I wouldn't move up to Bantamweight. I wouldn't stop.
[00:39:34] But I wasn't even big enough for Superfly. Right. Let alone Bantamweight. But I was 9 stone 10 at the time. So to get back 9 to 8 for it. So 18 pound. And I'm that big. So it's hard. Do you know what I mean? It's a lot. I've done it eventually then. I know. It just takes a lot out of your life. It does. And it chips you out. And after you're doing it so many times. So many times. So many times. It's horrible really. So look. If you're not. If you're kind of your nutrition isn't on point. Are you just trained like day in, day out. Trying to chip away at that. We eat. To train.
[00:40:04] We eat to train. And nothing more like. You'd eat to train. And then you'd be eating nothing. Like starving yourself. Or on protein shakes. But no. I eat more food now. Because I have high protein. High fat. I wouldn't say low carbs. But not as high calorie. I don't have a lot of sugar and stuff like that. Do you know what I mean? I'm more mindful. Less treats. Ice cream is probably my weakness. Especially now. The weather's nice. And a couple of ciders. But overall it's in moderation. Where before. It was all or nothing. There was no moderation. There was no balance. Where does that.
[00:40:34] Where does that. Who's responsibility. Because you've got a promoter. Their job is to promote you. Does that kind of fall in with them. To help you out with other things. You've got your trainer. Again it's not necessarily their job. You're self-employed. And you're a man. I think. If you're a new professional. Maybe people should lead you in the right direction. But at the same time. You can lead a horse towards it. I mean. You're going to drink it. But it's nice. Yeah. But you should at least be led there. Shouldn't you? I thought at some points. I could have had more support. But as I said. You're self-employed.
[00:41:04] It's a business. You know. A big thing. Because I was such a small man. Like a lighter weight. Not one of the popular weights. That weren't. That didn't work in my life. If I was a heavy weight. I'd have been looked after. And red carpet. Carpets rolled out. Because I was a midi. Pretty funny for fuck. Pretty funny now. Have you found that in boxing in general? It's not the most popular weight. Is it really? And every time I was fighting. I was killing myself to make weight. So any amateurs. I was knocking people. Like left, right and centre. With head guards and bros. In the professional. I was showing you doing it easier.
[00:41:33] But I was killing myself to make weight. It took a lot out of my own performance. Well like I said. My own fault. And I'm trying to pass on the knowledge now. To the lads at our gym. Talk to us about Australia. So what it was. I've actually been to Australia. In Commonwealth Games. I thought. What a big country. Growing up. We watched Naive's Home. When I was a kid. Calling him a look. Anyway. You can usually be watching Jason Donovan. Craig McLaughlin actually. So yeah. After I've gone to Australia.
[00:42:02] I thought it was a beautiful place. Then I went now on a holiday. One of my best friends. Steve. Still lives there now. He's a sparker. He's got a missus. Kids. Everything. He's got Australian citizenship. And I was just. I felt like. After the prize fight. I don't know where my life was going really. Especially in England. So I thought. I went to Australia on holiday. And then I thought. I got something to a bloke called Gareth Williams. And he's Mrs. Shara. At a gym called The Boxing Shop. In Brisbane. My mate Steve took me there. And lots. They said. You know what. Come over and train. You know what I mean. I thought.
[00:42:32] I'm disillusioned with England now. I was training up in Manchester. With Antifano. And like I said. I was half training. Half not. Because I had no fights coming up. And then I. I went to Australia. Just for a holiday. And my mate. My best mate from England. Was living there. The people I met in a short amount of time. Because. St. Dom. Were how we get this. How we do that. And. It's really welcoming. Do you know what I mean. I would have been a big fish. No. A little fish in a big pond. No. A big fish. I'm a little fish. I can't be a big fish. A little fish in a little pond. Baby shark. I can do it. Baby shark. Do it.
[00:43:01] My daughter loves that. She's non-stop. She's got the sharks in her bath. So. So yeah. I thought I needed a break from England. And a break from boxing. And even though I was going over there to box. I felt like it was a new chapter in my life. In England. I feel. There's a lot of pressure. Especially when I've lost on TV a couple of times. Really. I wanted away from the spotlight. I suppose. Like when I lost the Laskins. That was on TV. When I lost the prize prize. That was both on Sky Sports. So a lot of people. So. It's amazing winning from the low team. But losing from the league.
[00:43:30] Chipped away with my pride a little bit. So I wanted to start again a little bit. In Australia. Like. Sad thing is. You know. I was there for three months. And I found out my mum had cancer. I had to come back home. You know. And I had one thought over there. I had another thought. It was scheduled. That my mum had been ill for ages. She'd be in and out the doctors all the time. Then my dad rang me. Like one day. I'd speak to my family regularly. He went. You know what? Done. Your mum's got cancer. I didn't know what to say. Then he rang me two days. About two or three days later. When he got more results. And it was. It was hard to even sell. Like.
[00:44:01] It was too late for him to do anything about it. It was my husband. She went to hospital. And I was like. I didn't know how many medications. How did he not have spotted you? What were they looking for? So I felt like I kind of got robbed really. My mum's only 54 when she passed away. And I fell in love with Rob. So. I come back from Australia. And when I knew it was terminal. I was packed my bag. And I'll come back to England on the same day. I said quickly goodbye to the people who'd become my family. Like Gareth and Shaw at the boxing shop. And Steve. And I was making good connections and friendships there. And come back. Yeah.
[00:44:31] I see my mum. She's in bed. And she looked like that man. She looked like my mum. But she didn't. In three months. She deteriorated so bad. It was mad. Then I went into the other bedroom. My dad's not an emotional. We gave each other probably the biggest hug I've had in my whole life. You know. And that changed my life again. A little bit. Then I didn't box again for another two years. So I didn't box two years when I stopped my tendon in my shoulder. Another two years. My mum had her illness. And passed away. I lost four years of my peak. So when people look back. Don't worry. You're in the world. I was all.
[00:45:00] The next year I got legitimate reasons. Like how am I going to box in a sling. Or how am I going to box when I'm burying my mum. Do you know what I mean? And then during that time. When I come back to England. I got my ex-partner pregnant. So when my mum was dying. I had a baby on the way. My mum like seen the bump. And when my mum was in the chapel of rest. I put a scan of my baby in with her. And yeah it was hard. And do you know what I mean? When I look back now. Why I didn't win as much. I've got good reasons why.
[00:45:30] You're human as well. You're not a boxing machine. To people who know me. I think I used to be very sensitive and quite emotional. I think with all the hardship I've been through. It's toughened me. Do you know what I mean? I can't be soft with my kids. With my goals. We'll be playing non-stop. Do you know what I mean? And I do love it. I'm a very proactive dad. I take my kids everywhere. I do everything with them. Do you know what I mean? When I was at Wayne's Boxing Shop the other day. My daughter was with me. When I'd done an exhibition. A couple of weeks before. My daughter Nancy. Done my corner.
[00:45:57] I'm a very proactive dad. I love my kids more than anything in the world. And with my mum. It's hard man. Then keeping my eye from boxing again. And I felt lost again. It's mad. But then having my daughter on the way. I think that was a blessing. Because she was born not long after my mum passed away. And my daughter's personal. She's probably outgoing. She loves dancing. She's energy. And my mum lives on in her anyway. Yeah. So like. Some of it's like. One come one goes. It's weird how it works out. Do you know why it's right that is?
[00:46:27] And it always seems to. Seems to work that way. Doesn't it? The universe. It does. But. If the population are all the time high. Then that don't make sense. Does it? And everyone who's been reincarnated. Everyone was famous. Weren't they? Where was all the beggars who've been reincarnated? Do you know what I mean? Have you seen some of them? Where they go. In my previous life. I was so and so. And someone goes. We've run. I've run the numbers. Your timelines overlap. They were still alive when you were born. I've never heard. I used to be a smackhead from Herdington. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. We can't all up in Kingdom right?
[00:46:56] Two million Lord Nalsons. It can't all be. It's impossible isn't it? So. So yeah. So just going back then. Looking back then. I know you say no regrets. But there's anything you do differently. I know you said about the nutrition and stuff. But it's. It can't. At the time. He was. I imagine you're like a local celeb. So people are saying. They want to buy you a top. They want to. And it's. And I suppose it's solid to be like. Let's not do that. Especially if there's no fights coming up.
[00:47:26] I was quite popular around. Like Herds and Sutton. Birmingham. And people always nice for me. I've been a big ticket seller. I'm always grateful to people who come to my fights. So yeah. People. You do get a lot of pats on the back. Don't you? And you can't say no to every drink. Or every few drinks. Can you? And. It's not like your celebrity. I don't see it that way. Because I'm a normal down to earth. Like working class lad. But some people might put you on a pedestal. But some people like you for that. And other people don't. Because you can't keep everyone happy. Can you?
[00:47:55] And if you have one cup of tea. You're probably mugging it. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Would you do anything different though? I would have. Med eight stone from the get go. I think I would have. When I first turned pro. I was at a gym for. A couple of years. I think I should have moved gym sooner. I don't think I was progressing really. I think I was going backwards if anything. And. But. There are two things. There are two things. I'd say I definitely would have done differently. And obviously the make weight. And stuff like that. But yeah. Definitely move gym. Med eight stone.
[00:48:24] They're the two biggest things I'd say. Yeah. So we were talking before. A kind of off camera. Won't we about. Boxing. Bare knuckle and stuff. Where do you. Where do you sit with. Like the misfits. The celebrity boxing. Uh. Where do you know what. If people want to do something. Fair play to them. It's not professional boxing. As long as they don't get like twisted. And think they're something like the not. If people want to buy tickets. Go and watch them. Spend their hard-earn money. Fair play to them. You can't knock someone from making a pound. Can you. So I'm not against it.
[00:48:54] There's a place for it. But. And I'll get. They've got to sell fights. And you've got to hype things up. But. I don't see them as the same sport really. Do you know what I mean. There's. Well. Professional boxing. And this other. Mickey Mouse boxing relay. Does it need. That it's kind of got to be diluted. And go that way. For there to be more money involved. Always. It is entertainment. And not boxing. Yeah. And if it puts bums on seats. And people want to watch it. What. Who am I to argue with it. Do you know what I mean.
[00:49:24] You know what I mean. Like I said. There's a place for it. But. It's not professional boxing. Yeah. So. You talked about. You're training now. And. You had the exhibition. A couple of weeks ago. You're in. Wine's shop. How are you finding that side? Do you know what. I always knew. I was going to be a coach anyway. From. Because even. When I was training myself. I'd be helping the youngsters. My younger brother. I used to box. He followed. Billy Joe Saunders. As I. But my brother. Boxed at a good level. So. He's younger than me.
[00:49:54] But I was always helping him. And little Mickey Rooney. And other local lads. I've always helped them. Because. I don't know. I just have. I find it's a natural progression. Then when I finish boxing. My last couple of fights. I was trying at Eastside. And I was also trying at West Warwick's Boxing Club. To come back to water centre. I was at both gyms. Some. One gym. I get pads up. When I go out sparring. And all that. So. I felt. It's a natural progression. For me. To go to West Warwick's. And. As from. The. Uh. The exhibition. The other day. Mike Cole. Uh. Is a mentor. For these. Uh. Sen lads. And he said. Do you want to do an exhibition down? And. Um.
[00:50:24] I said. Yeah. So. Before the fight. Liam. The lad of the next. With the exhibition. I went and spoke to him. And. It might have been a bit daunting for him. So. I put him in his ear. I said. Listen. I'm hardly going to hit you. Yeah. You're going to. You're going to bash me tonight. But I want you to enjoy the experience. And. Have fun. And don't be nervous. And I spoke to him. And his dad. And parents before. To make him feel comfortable. Because. Um.
[00:50:54] Since then. I've kept in touch with him. I asked John Pegg for some tickets. For. You all know John Pegg. He's just brilliant for Birmingham. British boxing. I asked him for some tickets. For a show. For. Uh. The Sen lads. And um. So. Liam. His dad. And somebody who had. Uh. Boxers. Who probably never been to a professional boxing show. So I said. Thank you to Johnny. Give him some tickets. So dad. I know it's out. Like I said. I've got a relationship. It's like a friendship now. Then I obviously. I went down to Wayne's shop. And I was going to get him some gloves. Of some equipment. But Wayne being a man. Lizzie.
[00:51:23] He'd give us the clubs to the charge. You know. I've known Wayne since I was 10. 11. Do you know what I mean? And uh. I've tried. He's an amateur. As a pro. We went to America training together. And he's sold the earth anyway. Do you know what I mean? So uh. Thank you very much to him. And uh. Look. I've spoke to Liam's dad since. You know. I'm still going to. Help his journey. And I want to make awareness. For like. Uh. People with um. Disabilities. Or whether it's. Autism. Or whatever. A lot of my mates. Zoe Robinson. She's a Paralympic gold medalist. She's a realtor.
[00:51:53] A lot of boccia. And she's a legend. But she loves boxing. If she could be a boxer. You've got the heart of a boxer. I'm telling you. You. And. All the boxers know her. And like I've talked on her pads before. And uh. I felt boxing like. If it can make people happy. Why not? It's not always about fighting. It's about boxing as a sport. The fitness. The discipline. All the good things that come with it. The camaraderie. Sometimes. Making a. A friendship network. Or just burning off energy. Whatever it is. Boxing should be in all schools. It should be on the curriculum.
[00:52:22] I remember when I was a 10 year old. At junior. Birch Green Junior School. Uh. My uh. Teacher Mr Benton. He went. Darn it. Don't do boxing. It's too. It's too much of a tool. So. He's not. Nose a lot out. I thought. Listen you. You're not the same person. You're not from the same club for me. You're sausage. You know what I mean? Boxing's for me. Might not have been for you. And imagine if I listened to his voice. And stopped it. So sometimes you've got to. Because I need you. You've got to have a will. To progress at something. Can't you? Use bits of. Fuel for the fire. Don't you? We always talk about that. With people here. You could either. Be that person.
[00:52:52] Who goes. Alright then sir. And goes and gets a job elsewhere. And doesn't bother. Or you can use that to be like. Still thinking about it. 25 years later. Someone tells me. I can't do something. I'm going to do it. Do you know what I mean? I think because I'm small. And I'm very proud man. Don't tell me. I can't do nothing. Do you know what I mean? I can't. I can't jump very high. Do you know what I mean? Jump very far. But do you know what I mean? I'll have a go. I'll have a go. But yeah. Most people that we've had on. Generally. Yeah. Sporting professionals. They've all seemed to have a kind of moment. Where someone's told them. No don't do that.
[00:53:21] Or you're not going to be able to do that. And you go nah. All my life. Do you know what I mean? So. It's nice to prove people wrong. But more or less. You're going to do it for yourself. It's nice to see other people have egg on their face. And prove them wrong. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Okay. So just to finish up. I'm going to do some quick fire with you. So. Best boxer you've ever faced? Ray Shee Warren. Three top. An American. Three time Olympian. Professional World Champion. And Amateur World Champion. Won everything.
[00:53:52] Do you know what I mean? What a level. I don't know if you were that can you. What a level of competition I fought at. Do you know what I mean? Up there. High. Did you ever. Did you ever fought anyone like that where. You felt like there was another level to the game that you weren't aware of? Did you ever step out of ringer? Why? No. Nah. I've never fought. When I first turned senior. When I won the ABAs at 19. And I got for senior England at 19. I fought the current world champion and an Olympic medalist. But I don't feel like my depth. I don't think I've ever fought out of my depth against anyone. No. If I. Like.
[00:54:22] Some of the parts. People are bigger. Have you. Some of the squad. Frankie. Or Amir Khan. Technical things. Maybe yes. But. But people my own weight. No matter what age. I've never felt like. I've learned against people better than me. But I never thought. Bloody hell. Like. That's like. The levels is like. Do you know what I mean? Light years. Right now. Never. What was it. To be fair. Just off. Off. Thing a little bit there. What was it like seeing Amir Khan. As a. As a young boy. Do you know what? He come into the senior squad at 17. I was 19. I was one of the youngest on the senior squad. So that's what we. We got on so well. Because.
[00:54:52] He's 17. I'll probably have the mentality of a 17. I'll be 19. Because men. Allegedly. Mature. Slower than women. Anyway. Different commensary. We're all still waiting. Am I? We're all still waiting. Yeah we are. So yeah. So we brought a good rapport. We're both young and. Like on squads. With Sneak. I'm going to have a kebab. We'll just be out. Messing about really. Because it was young at heart. Look. Thrill seekers. And I still speak to him in now. And like. You don't know. He was so talented. It was. The youngest lad on the senior squad. He's a junior. But he's better than all the seniors.
[00:55:22] And that's the truth. Them hands were lightning. He's a fast man. And he's got big balls. Big heart. Do you know what I mean? You know. Our first tournament. We went together. We was a senior. It was called the Adidas Box Gala. In Germany. And we fought in three different cities. Against England. Ireland. Lithuania. In Germany. And we fought against all. Like a round robin. And Amir. Fought in world number three. Martin Dressen. From Germany. So in his own country. And Amir stopped him. And busted him. And there was like. That was a. A log. A log. The moment. Chin on the floor moment.
[00:55:51] This kid is absolutely special. So it's no surprise. He went on to achieve what he did. Like. I didn't know. Everyone knew. Do you know what I mean? Everyone was like. Chin on the floor. This glad is. Special and amazing. Do you think. Do you think the Canelo fault was a mistake for him? Do you know what? Financially no. Didn't hinder his career. Because how good Canelo is. Probably not. I think didn't he play himself any good. Do you know what I mean? But um. Does that take it out?
[00:56:21] Does. What does that. What does a knockout like that take out you? A lot. But he didn't get battered for 12 rounds. He probably left that one shot knockout. Probably less than getting battered. But like I've seen him here not long ago. And he's still got all his faxes. And he's just a funny side. I feel like none of us have grown up really. It's quite a man. I feel like kids sitting there now. So um. But yeah. The thing is. He wants to. And I'll tell my heart to assume. He didn't have to have that fight. And he's trying to tell himself. He's chasing greatness. And you've got to admire that. Do you know what I mean? He could sit back and have loads of easy defences. Yeah. So no.
[00:56:50] I admire the balls he got to do that. Because I don't. People loan it to Canelo for the money. I get it. But like. The same time. People don't want to find. Because what can happen. Well he was winning the fight. Wasn't he? He was. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah. You get beyond one of them. Yeah. Kind of like Brooke and Golovkin as well. Weren't it? Yeah. Then you're coming up. Sam again he moved up again for the make of life. Like. You know. Us being boxers. I think we're not scared to like. Fight in general. Then to move up a weight. It's a. And we see it as a challenge maybe.
[00:57:20] And normally we're at that weight in the gym anyway. Of not our boxing. But it's probably what I'm walking around at. A weight maybe. But then by the time our opponent gets in the ring. They're even heavier again. Yeah. So it's mad. But no risk. No gain. No guts. No glory. Have a go man. And to be fair. He was on the Mexican steak as well. Weren't he? At the time. Canelo. And the old Mexican meat. Allegedly. Yeah. Allegedly I think. Sorry. Carry on the quick files. A little bit sidetracked then. That's alright. I think you've already answered it. With one fight you'd love to have back.
[00:57:51] Either for. The best or the worst. Or the. The adulation or. Probably the Laskins fight. Because. That hindered my career loads. But like I said. It would be after. Looking back now. Probably the wrong fight at the time. But. But then I fought him against him. Maybe not. I don't know. I suppose my first loss when I was 11. I remember. It was my sixth fall. Well my first five. Then I went to Wales to box on the Midlands. With Midland Select. And I lost a lad named Henry James. Because he did take a professional. Years on.
[00:58:20] And I crawled all the way back from Wales. Do you know what I mean? But I beat him twice. Actually I beat him twice. After that. So maybe not. I don't know. I've been putting it in too many times. And on this beat me. If you want it. Let me know. Man I'm ready. Call him. Call him out. Anyone. Alive or dead. A fighter that you'd love to face. In your heyday. Tapia. Definitely yeah. Yeah. Like I read his book. And what a life he led. Do you know what I mean?
[00:58:50] Like loads of craziness. Like with his family. And being brought where he was. Yeah. Johnny Tapia. 100%. My vida loca. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. I'd watch that. Like a celebrity death match one. Crazy. I'll bat him. If you want it. Yeah. So just finally then. So you've experienced highs and lows. What advice would you give to the kids that you're coaching now? Maybe someone who's watching this. Who's a young Brummie lad who wants to get into the business. Work hard.
[00:59:19] Stay dedicated. Stay grounded. The people you meet on the way off. You meet them on the way back down. Nutrition. Strength and conditioning. If you're the best in the gym. Move gym. Always try and. Always just try and improve. Do better. You know what I mean? We're never the finished article. You can always learn. Like we learn from my mistakes. It's probably worse than people's mistakes. Just get yourself out there. And like this down there. Your social media. Get yourself built up. Because that's ultimately.
[00:59:49] It's going to make your life probably more financially secure. And at the same time. I want success more than money. Because that's. And I thought it would have come with it. Because I think. I chasing legacy. And I want to be. I want people to look back and think. Oh dumb. Wally won. Robin what you got in the bank. That's how I see it anyway. Or it's how you start off I suppose. So do I chase the glory. And everything else will come with it. And just. You know. Yeah. Be a good person. Ain't it? Yeah mate. Excellent. Perfect mate. Yes lads.
[01:00:18] Thanks for your time man. Brilliant. We currently have five and a half thousand members. Over half a million views. So. Let's convert some views into memberships. And that will continue to enable us to. Bring great guests on. And continue making great podcasts. Thanks.